tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-172417803867627775.post5995156925997638067..comments2023-05-18T03:50:23.681-07:00Comments on The Center for Theological Studies: Life Is Not Exactly Like The Movies...Byronhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/11537490279115937176noreply@blogger.comBlogger5125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-172417803867627775.post-43191784760159856502010-10-31T05:28:37.420-07:002010-10-31T05:28:37.420-07:00Debate Oneness Versus Trinity, Feb.2010
http://ww...Debate Oneness Versus Trinity, Feb.2010<br /><br />http://www.mediafire.com/?8ydnuutfcpafbj6mlculwellhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13160062102050436408noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-172417803867627775.post-64705637543244704362010-10-30T17:06:36.259-07:002010-10-30T17:06:36.259-07:00Dr. Lemke,
You're quite right indeed. I'...Dr. Lemke,<br /><br /> You're quite right indeed. I'm rather sure that Molinism doesn't do it. When it comes to the problem of evil, sadly enough, Molinism and Calvinism provide the same answer.<br /><br /> This may surprise you, but there was a time (earlier this year) when I wanted to be a Molinist. I was disappointed when my conscience wouldn't allow it. I did investigate Molinism, however. I took time to read it and study it. Here at the blog, I've discussed Molinism and Dr. Keathley's book so much because I keep coming back to it, always asking myself whether or not I'm thinking rightly. I may write with a bit of power in my words, but I do so because I've honestly been quite sympathetic to Molinism. <br /><br />In the end, sadly enough, I'm so heartbroken that Molinism is not a viable option for my conscience. As a Classic Arminian, I am quite content and happy. I've learned that my theology will not answer everything (neither will anyone else's); but at least I can live with what my theology cannot provide. I could not live with a theology that implicates God in evil.Deidre Richardson, B.A., M.Div.https://www.blogger.com/profile/04415891901162852180noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-172417803867627775.post-31714001150627917452010-10-30T16:38:33.934-07:002010-10-30T16:38:33.934-07:00Yeah, and if God chooses everything, Molinism is j...Yeah, and if God chooses everything, Molinism is just soft determinism. According to Keathley in <i>Salvation and Sovereignty</i>, God exercises “meticulous control” over all worldwide events, all decisions of human agents, and even all minor things such as “every roll of the dice, every flip of the coin, [and] every seemingly random event” (pp. 22-25). Keathley also insists that God is in “complete control” of all things (p. 157). Not only does that seem inseparable from determinism, but it seems like it puts Molinism back in the "God causes evil" category and offers not much improvement over the Calvinist answers to the problem of evil which make God the author of evil (He chose this world, after all). Dr. Keathley wants to avoid that, obviously, but I'm not sure if Molinism does it for him.Steve Lemkehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06892853747098200144noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-172417803867627775.post-43578777199122230632010-10-30T14:18:07.274-07:002010-10-30T14:18:07.274-07:00Dr. Lemke,
Let me just say thanks for responding...Dr. Lemke,<br /><br /> Let me just say thanks for responding. Your words are very insightful and encouraging.<br /><br /> Yes, in some sense, it seems as if Godawa is "Molinist" in his thinking, certainly so if you consider the fact that he references "Romans 9" in his commentary on movies and theology. But yes, ultimately, the point of the post seems to connect "determinism" and "Molinism" in some way. I respect Molinism's idea of certain "non-feasible worlds" due to human choice...but, at the same time, I think God's selection of a world gives what the right hand (i.e., non-feasible worlds) takes away.<br /><br /> Contemporary movies that involve improv are a major relief. My problem with Godawa stems from the fact that he mentioned nothing of the sort in his commentary on movies. Rather, he just generalized all movies under one and the same umbrella, making all movies seem as if the scriptwriter determines every move, every action, etc. <br /><br /> If Molinism did not involve the notion of "God selecting a world" where "I can freely choose every action," then I would agree with it. It's the "ultimately, God-decides-my-choice" idea inherent in the divine selection of worlds that prevents me from affirming Molinism. Can we not find some other way to express that God allows choices without determining them? <br /><br /> According to Dr. Keathley's work "Salvation and Sovereignty," Molinism does not answer the question of why evil and suffering exists in the world. It does not attempt to provide a theodicy...instead, it only tries to defend the setup that exists. While that may work for some, I desire answers to why evil exists. When I approach the atheist, I will still have mystery in my system (regarding why God was pleased to grant man free will)...however, I will not have mystery in my system regarding the existence of evil. Rather, I will be able to tell the atheist and unbeliever that evil exists because of humans who don't know how to appropriately use the divine gift of freedom.Deidre Richardson, B.A., M.Div.https://www.blogger.com/profile/04415891901162852180noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-172417803867627775.post-61761649353663629402010-10-30T11:06:45.861-07:002010-10-30T11:06:45.861-07:00Let me join in on your Determinist bashing (and, p...Let me join in on your Determinist bashing (and, perhaps, Molinist bashing). In either, God has scripted every event. In Determinism, freedom is nothing but an illusion. In Molinism, freedom is . . . freely chosen, without the knowledge that our choice has functionally already been decided for us. <br /><br />Life is not like the movies, but it might be like MAKING a movie (that is, sometimes several different endings are written, and decisions are made about which ending is chosen). <br /><br />But life is MORE like some contemporary dramas which are more like an improvisation. The plot can go several ways, depending on the choices of the characters. I oppose Open Theism, so I oppose the notion that nobody knows what the end will be. God knows the beginning, middle and end, both in the improvisation and in life. But this foreknowledge is with certainty, not necessity.Steve Lemkehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06892853747098200144noreply@blogger.com